[One Piece] “Marco the Phoenix Is Way Too Weak” — 2018 Japanese Fans Tear Apart Whitebeard’s First Division Commander
Beasts Pirates
Marco the Phoenix — June 2018 Was Whitebeard’s Right-Hand Man Actually Overrated?
Marco is immortal, airborne, and stood at the center of Marineford. So why were Japanese fans already calling him “weak” in 2018? This thread shows how brutally high the bar really was.
Early Impressions
1: Anonymous Pirate. 2018/06/23 Got careless and ended up with seastone handcuffs on him.
CLANK!! Marco “!!?”
Marco “Seastone!!”
SLASH!! SLASH!! Marco “Ugh!!!”
Whitebeard Pirates Crew Member “Captain Marco!!!”
2: Anonymous Pirate. 2018/06/23 Gets punched by Garp, who isn’t even a Devil Fruit user.
Garp “Nghhh!!!” THUD!!
Marco “!!?”
3: Anonymous Pirate. 2018/06/23 Honestly, he just looks like fodder.
Marines “First Division Commander!!!” “Marco!!!”
Marco “You’re not taking down ‘King’ that easily, man.”
Devil Fruit Expectations
5: Anonymous Pirate. 2018/06/23 That ability is insanely strong, though.
17: Anonymous Pirate. 2018/06/23 >>5 A fake phoenix with limited regeneration uses is trash.
Blackbeard Loss
6: Anonymous Pirate. 2018/06/23 He got completely crushed by Blackbeard.
Robin “That’s right… It was a massive battle, with reinforcements on both sides. —And Marco’s group was utterly defeated.”
“It was after that battle that ‘Blackbeard’ became known as one of the Four Emperors…!!”
126: Anonymous Pirate. 2018/06/23 >>6 He probably got beaten after his powers were sealed by Dark-Dark.
161: Anonymous Pirate. 2018/06/23 >>6 If you don’t know the context, it looks like the guy on the left is setting Marco on fire.
357: Anonymous Pirate. 2018/06/23 >>6 Marco’s ability has terrible compatibility with the Dark-Dark Fruit. No way he beats Blackbeard with Dark + Quake.
Commander Comparisons
12: Anonymous Pirate. 2018/06/23 Position-wise, he’s basically equal to Katakuri.
14: Anonymous Pirate. 2018/06/23 Looks like fire, but doesn’t even have fire properties. That’s just sad.
39: Anonymous Pirate. 2018/06/23
One Piece Fan Nice to meet you, Oda-sensei. After reading Volume 57, I was wondering about something. I don’t really understand how strong Marco the Phoenix’s Mythical Zoan-type ability is compared to Ace’s Flame-Flame Fruit. It’s kind of unclear to me.
Eiichiro Oda (Author) Yeah. That makes sense. This war arc is being pushed forward at a very fast pace, with explanations intentionally kept to a minimum to prioritize momentum.
To explain Marco’s ability just a little for now: since he’s a Zoan-type, he naturally has a very tough body. On top of that, thanks to the phoenix’s power of blue flames of regeneration, he can regenerate his wounds and effectively nullify attacks (though there is a limit to that regeneration).
In other words, his flames exist for regeneration. These blue flames don’t actually have the usual properties of real fire—like spreading or producing extreme heat. They’re completely different from Ace’s flames.
I might touch on this in the main story someday, so for now, that’s all I’ll say.
Kizaru “Giant Squad!! And keep an eye on the sky toooo—!!!”
135: Anonymous Pirate. 2018/06/23 >>63 Marco haters should comment on this kick. That’s straight-up Gear 4–level power.
Yonko Crews in General
210: Anonymous Pirate. 2018/06/24 Even mid-tier commanders can casually hunt Krieg-class enemies. Yonko crews are insane.
247: Anonymous Pirate. 2018/06/24 >>210 Feels like he learned some weird martial art from early One Piece days.
Whitebeard Pirates Criticism
143: Anonymous Pirate. 2018/06/23
Ace “You’re ‘smoke’… and I’m ‘fire.’” “With our abilities, this fight isn’t gonna be decided.”
Blackbeard “Nnngahhh!!! Hot—hot—hot!!!” (Blackbeard goes up in flames)
Ace “…I get just how terrifying the power of ‘darkness’ is now— but that’s strange…!!” “If you’re a Logia, you should’ve been able to shrug off an attack like that.”
179: Anonymous Pirate. 2018/06/23 Marco = fodder Jozu = fodder stopped by fodder Vista = equal to Mihawk Vista is the strongest.
243: Anonymous Pirate. 2018/06/23 Whitebeard Pirates: 4 Devil Fruit users Big Mom Pirates: 11 Devil Fruit users Closest crew to Pirate King lol
253: Anonymous Pirate. 2018/06/23 >>243 Beast Pirates have over 500, including SMILE users.
Strategy and Worldbuilding Complaints
368: Anonymous Pirate. 2018/06/23 If Whitebeard really wanted to save Ace, he should’ve taken Celestial Dragons hostage.
388: Anonymous Pirate. 2018/06/23 Does the Navy even have Conqueror’s Haki users? Aokiji looked scared as hell.
415: Anonymous Pirate. 2018/06/23 >>389 Because he keeps pushing Luffy into a corner every single time…
414: Anonymous Pirate. 2018/06/23 >>390 A Yonko’s second-in-command is above the Warlords, you know.
404: Anonymous Pirate. 2018/06/23 Whitebeard Pirates were basically a one-man team. Big Mom’s crew is tricky, Whitebeard’s are just meatheads.
406: Anonymous Pirate. 2018/06/23 Without Haki, Logias were obviously too strong. That’s on Oda’s early balance.
455: Anonymous Pirate. 2018/06/23 >>406 Logias weren’t even necessary. Just make secretion-type powers instead.
419: Anonymous Pirate. 2018/06/23 If your Haki is stronger, attacks get nullified, right?
Pica “If I coat myself in Haki, you won’t be able to cut me!!!” Zoro “—That’s only if your Haki… was stronger than mine.” Pica “!?”
Tashigi “Trafalgar—if that’s what you’re going to do!!” Smoker “Stop it, Tashigi!! Your Haki won’t be enough to take it!!!”
Akainu vs Jinbe
“!! He stabbed him with Haki!!?” “Is he dead!? Aokiji!!” Aokiji “NO~~~~!!! Don’t be stupid.” Akainu “Tch…!! So damn irritating……!!” “A Haki user, huh…” “Can’t you see that ‘Fire Fist (Ace)’ is already beyond saving?” Vista “A single moment of carelessness I’ll regret forever!!” Marco “How could this happen…!!”
Katakuri vs Marco
463: Anonymous Pirate. 2018/06/23 So who’s stronger, Katakuri or Marco?
493: Anonymous Pirate. 2018/06/23 >>463 Conqueror’s Haki, best Observation in the series, Awakening, ranged attacks, undefeated vs No Conqueror’s, no Observation feats, only kicks, just flies around like a sandbag. Yeah, it’s obvious.
580: Anonymous Pirate. 2018/06/23 Can Marco regenerate after taking a direct hit like this?
“The one who destroys the enemies of the crown.”
590: Anonymous Pirate. 2018/06/23 >>580 He wouldn’t even take damage.
Ability Balance
666: Anonymous Pirate. 2018/06/23 Regeneration + flight is cheat-tier, so the only way to balance him is making him lazy and weak.
722: Anonymous Pirate. 2018/06/23 The “only five confirmed flying abilities in the world” setting — is that still alive?
755: Anonymous Pirate. 2018/06/23 >>722 Doflamingo doesn’t really fly. Logias just float. No idea about Shiki.
11: Anonymous Pirate. 2018/06/23 He took an admiral’s beam and came out unharmed, though…
👉 Why Japanese Fans Judge Marco So Harshly
In Japan, endurance alone isn’t enough. Top commanders are expected to decisively defeat other top tiers. Marco survives everything — but rarely ends fights.
👉 Marco as a Victim of Power Inflation
Marco was designed before Haki fully stabilized the power system. By 2018 standards, regeneration without finishing power feels outdated. That gap is why fans call him “weak,” not useless.
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